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giannisd
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There are new FIC boundary in Italy and new frequency since July, but not yet implemented on the SD map. The new near Rome is important.... Regards,
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Tim Dawson
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Thanks, we will look into this. I recall the FIC boundaries in Italy are traditionally very poorly documented in the AIP.
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AM22
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+xThanks, we will look into this. I recall the FIC boundaries in Italy are traditionally very poorly documented in the AIP. I fell into this trap last week! Very often the wrong FIS frequency!
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Tim Dawson
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As far as we can tell, the map posted above is not correct, and the borders and frequencies in SkyDemon are correct.
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giannisd
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+xAs far as we can tell, the map posted above is not correct, and the borders and frequencies in SkyDemon are correct. The new FIC/FIS of Rome (centre) 119.075 will start on 15 June and will be published on the national AIP the 13 July, please note that the previous standard arr/dep route will be cancelled. AIP updating depends on the willingness of the ENAC employees.....  
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giannisd
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Group: Forum Members
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+x+xThanks, we will look into this. I recall the FIC boundaries in Italy are traditionally very poorly documented in the AIP. I fell into this trap last week! Very often the wrong FIS frequency! Yes Tim the coordinates of the whole FIC are correct, but there is a NOTAM A6542/23 : LIBB LIMM LIRR Periodo (UTC): 11/09/23 11:18 - 09/12/23 23:59 (stimato) ROMA ACC AREA. ROMA FIC FREQ WITHIN AREA DESCRIBED IN NOTE (10) COLUMN RMK: - FREQ 125.750MHZ NOT AVAILABLE SOUTH OF LINE JOINING POINTS 420301N0111745E 421500N0112149E AND 421500N0134059E - FREQ 119.075MHZ NOT AVAILABLE NORTH OF LINE JOINING POINTS 420301N0111745E 421500N0112149E AND 421500N0134059E REF AIP ENR 2.1.1.2-3/4
that depict how to contact the FIS if you are north or south of this line dividing the FIC into 2 areas: south of this line pilots should use the freq 119.075, and north 126.750, so why not draw this LINE on your map and specify the two frequencies to be used on the flight information as per Note (10) column ?
regards, Gianni
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Tim Dawson
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We don't usually make permanent changes to our map based on a NOTAM, which are by their nature temporary. If this becomes a permanent change it will make it into the AIP and at that point the permanent data in our chart will change. In the meantime, we are presumably showing the NOTAM in the briefing and therefore making the information available. If you have information about whether (and when) these changes are likely to become permanent, that would be useful.
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giannisd
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+xWe don't usually make permanent changes to our map based on a NOTAM, which are by their nature temporary. If this becomes a permanent change it will make it into the AIP and at that point the permanent data in our chart will change. In the meantime, we are presumably showing the NOTAM in the briefing and therefore making the information available. If you have information about whether (and when) these changes are likely to become permanent, that would be useful. Tim, I can see on the Italy map, many NOTAM that are temporary over airports or areas like those for the Gliding Grand Prix (it was only for 10 days, I know because I made the NOTAM ! ). This NOTAM of the 2 frequencies is for 4 months, probably will be extended, and is related mainly to pilots heading to LIRU.
Another solution would be to include it, temporarily, on the "RADIO SERVICE of Roma Information", both frequencies with a reference to the NOTAM or with a synthetic instruction on how to choose the correct frequency, north or south when in that area.
The ATC of the Roma FIC will appreciate this effort since pilots navigating with SkyDemon (many) do not read NOTAM......or they use only the frequency depicted on the Radio Information: 125.750.
Is up to you, regards, Gianni
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giannisd
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 95,
Visits: 139
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+xWe don't usually make permanent changes to our map based on a NOTAM, which are by their nature temporary. If this becomes a permanent change it will make it into the AIP and at that point the permanent data in our chart will change. In the meantime, we are presumably showing the NOTAM in the briefing and therefore making the information available. If you have information about whether (and when) these changes are likely to become permanent, that would be useful.  Tim,
the coordinates of the 4 FIS Areas of Rome and Brindisi are detailed on the REMARKS Section of ENR 2.1.1.2.2.1 page of AIP, and for each area the relative frequency to be used is also indicated.
The NOTAM is still in use, but now the coordinates and relative frequency are published on National AIP.
The depicted dotted green lines on Skydemon map should be amended accordingly, in particularly check the lines I have hilglited by a red arrows since on Skydemon map are different and not corret.
regards,
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Tim Dawson
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Hello Gianne, the remarks section is indeed where we pull FIS boundaries in Italy from. You raised this point once before, and the map you attached to your post turned out to be incorrect. Can I ask where you obtained the map in your latest post from?
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