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giannisd
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Group: Forum Members
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Good day Tim, Bologna CTR is divided in 2 zone Freq. 133.775 (N of the Line) and 118.150 (S of the Line) would be possible to see the divided line on the map and add N and S to the relative freq. ?  Would be possible to show, when you touch the zone on the screen, the 2 frequency NW 124.15 and SE 126.425 for Padova FIC as for MIlano, Brindisi and Rome FIC ?  best regards, Gianni
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giannisd
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 89,
Visits: 82
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+xGood day Tim, Bologna CTR is divided in 2 zone Freq. 133.775 (N of the Line) and 118.150 (S of the Line) would be possible to see the divided line on the map and add N and S to the relative freq. ? Would be possible to show, when you touch the zone on the screen, the 2 frequency NW 124.15 and SE 126.425 for Padova FIC as for MIlano, Brindisi and Rome FIC ? best regards, Gianni I noted that Milano FIC/FIS border are not correct. Could you be more precise with borders and could you divide the Padova FIS in the 2 zone/freq as per my request ?
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Tim Dawson
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Group: Forum Members
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Are you sure we are not already dividing the frequencies? We do not show FIS boundaries on the map but on iOS/Android you can long-press to receive information about FIS, and when you select a service its boundaries are briefly shown.
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giannisd
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 89,
Visits: 82
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+xAre you sure we are not already dividing the frequencies? We do not show FIS boundaries on the map but on iOS/Android you can long-press to receive information about FIS, and when you select a service its boundaries are briefly shown. I'm sure. If you long press inside Padova FIC/FIS only one (124.150) freq appear, whereas the SE freq (126.425) is missed, the dividing line and the freq is depicted on the previous picture. Milano, Roma and Brindisi are OK. I see the various N, E or S freq. Regarding the FIC/FIS boundaries between MIlano, Padova, Roma and Brindisi, I know they appear with long press, but sometime are not correct. Look in the center of the attached picture, you will note that the FIC/FIS boundaries line are the same as ACC or CTA dividing line and follow a series of IFR reporting points. If you look at SD map, the yellow line, that appear after long press, does not follow the ACC or CTA boundaries, nor these IFR points. Small difference, i.e. your line is passing FRZ VOR whereas the correct is more N, or your line is passing over PRU whereas the correct should be more NE. These line & points are important for us because we must call the FIS to change freq. regards, Gianni 
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Tim Dawson
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Group: Forum Members
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Thank you for the clarification. I can see there are two separate issues here (perhaps three).
For Bologna CTR there isn't a straightforward fix in SkyDemon, as our airspace data is intended to map to frequencies hosted at airfields. In this case it works ok and both frequencies appear in the What's Here menu for the Bologna CTR airspace pieces, but there is no information helping the pilot decide which frequency to use. We could apply E or W to the frequencies, but on our map we cannot easily split the whole thing up into two pieces.
The Padova FIS issue is recognised and I will ensure we fix this for the next chart update, coming this Thursday. Unfortunately Italy has historically not published the FIS boundaries in a format which is straightforward for chart producers to consume. Even now, they do not give the coordinates for the different sectors but instead refer the reader to a PDF chart, showing a line roughly following a river. Precision is apparently not a high priority. Nevertheless, we will reproduce this data as best we can.
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giannisd
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 89,
Visits: 82
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+xThank you for the clarification. I can see there are two separate issues here (perhaps three). For Bologna CTR there isn't a straightforward fix in SkyDemon, as our airspace data is intended to map to frequencies hosted at airfields. In this case it works ok and both frequencies appear in the What's Here menu for the Bologna CTR airspace pieces, but there is no information helping the pilot decide which frequency to use. We could apply E or W to the frequencies, but on our map we cannot easily split the whole thing up into two pieces. The Padova FIS issue is recognised and I will ensure we fix this for the next chart update, coming this Thursday. Unfortunately Italy has historically not published the FIS boundaries in a format which is straightforward for chart producers to consume. Even now, they do not give the coordinates for the different sectors but instead refer the reader to a PDF chart, showing a line roughly following a river. Precision is apparently not a high priority. Nevertheless, we will reproduce this data as best we can. I understand your points. Milano FIS is divided along the river or along an Intersection Points line from Roma FIS, Padova NW and SW is divided by a depicted line on the N, but on the center area along a line that follow the CTR boundaries, South area is again a line that follow several Intersections, Roma and Brindisi have coordinates lines and easy to see the area. RE Bologna: If you apply the E and W to the freq will be perfect, but should appear as: Bologna East CTR 118.150 , Bologna West CTR 133.775. Most of Italian Pilots already know the differences, but foreigners coming from NE, if they are low, probably do not receive any answer if call on the wrong freq, especially at the extreme E or along the coast.  Sometime when we use a small screen (Mini iPad or iPhone) and we press the screen for info, the box cover the the spot, would be possible to move the box with the finger and adjust the lap time of the yellow line ? regards, Gianni
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giannisd
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 89,
Visits: 82
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+x+xThank you for the clarification. I can see there are two separate issues here (perhaps three). For Bologna CTR there isn't a straightforward fix in SkyDemon, as our airspace data is intended to map to frequencies hosted at airfields. In this case it works ok and both frequencies appear in the What's Here menu for the Bologna CTR airspace pieces, but there is no information helping the pilot decide which frequency to use. We could apply E or W to the frequencies, but on our map we cannot easily split the whole thing up into two pieces. The Padova FIS issue is recognised and I will ensure we fix this for the next chart update, coming this Thursday. Unfortunately Italy has historically not published the FIS boundaries in a format which is straightforward for chart producers to consume. Even now, they do not give the coordinates for the different sectors but instead refer the reader to a PDF chart, showing a line roughly following a river. Precision is apparently not a high priority. Nevertheless, we will reproduce this data as best we can. I understand your points. Milano FIS is divided along the river or along an Intersection Points line from Roma FIS, Padova NW and SW is divided by a depicted line on the N, but on the center area along a line that follow the CTR boundaries, South area is again a line that follow several Intersections, Roma and Brindisi have coordinates lines and easy to see the area. RE Bologna: If you apply the E and W to the freq will be perfect, but should appear as: Bologna East CTR 118.150 , Bologna West CTR 133.775. Most of Italian Pilots already know the differences, but foreigners coming from NE, if they are low, probably do not receive any answer if call on the wrong freq, especially at the extreme E or along the coast. Sometime when we use a small screen (Mini iPad or iPhone) and we press the screen for info, the box cover the the spot, would be possible to move the box with the finger and adjust the lap time of the yellow line ? regards, Gianni Tim, today i downloaded the update and I see Padova FIS 2 areas, is much better, the 2 freq are now present, but the boundary is still not correct on the southern part. The South FIS boundary should follow the alignment of these Intersections Points shown on my picture, same for Milano FIS southern part, the boundary is not correct, and should follow a line of these Intersection points (Tuscany area), see my picture posted before. Take in consideration, also, that FIR boundary between Milano and Roma FIR is not the boundary of Milano and Padova FIS. If you need more help let me know, regards, Gianni
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giannisd
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 89,
Visits: 82
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+xThank you for the clarification. I can see there are two separate issues here (perhaps three). For Bologna CTR there isn't a straightforward fix in SkyDemon, as our airspace data is intended to map to frequencies hosted at airfields. In this case it works ok and both frequencies appear in the What's Here menu for the Bologna CTR airspace pieces, but there is no information helping the pilot decide which frequency to use. We could apply E or W to the frequencies, but on our map we cannot easily split the whole thing up into two pieces. The Padova FIS issue is recognised and I will ensure we fix this for the next chart update, coming this Thursday. Unfortunately Italy has historically not published the FIS boundaries in a format which is straightforward for chart producers to consume. Even now, they do not give the coordinates for the different sectors but instead refer the reader to a PDF chart, showing a line roughly following a river. Precision is apparently not a high priority. Nevertheless, we will reproduce this data as best we can. Tim, why you said that Italy historically does not published FIS boundaries ? Have look at our AIP NR 2.1.1.1-1, 2.1.1.1-2, 2.1.1.1-3, f or each FIR, after the lateral limits of each FIR characteristics , on the Remarks, is indicated the exact FIC/FIS boundaries. Since 08/dec/2016. regards, Gianni
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Tim Dawson
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 7.8K,
Visits: 8.4K
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Historically means in the past.
If Italy are now publishing coordinates for FIS boundaries that is great. Unfortunately we (the whole team) are currently exhibiting at Aero Friedrichshafen which limits the amount of time we can spend transcribing the Italian AIP. We will be able to get back to the FIS boundary alignments when we return.
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giannisd
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 89,
Visits: 82
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+xHistorically means in the past. If Italy are now publishing coordinates for FIS boundaries that is great. Unfortunately we (the whole team) are currently exhibiting at Aero Friedrichshafen which limits the amount of time we can spend transcribing the Italian AIP. We will be able to get back to the FIS boundary alignments when we return. OK, Have a successful show ! gianni
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