By giannisd - 3/30/2017 12:14:52 PM
+x+xThank you for the clarification. I can see there are two separate issues here (perhaps three). For Bologna CTR there isn't a straightforward fix in SkyDemon, as our airspace data is intended to map to frequencies hosted at airfields. In this case it works ok and both frequencies appear in the What's Here menu for the Bologna CTR airspace pieces, but there is no information helping the pilot decide which frequency to use. We could apply E or W to the frequencies, but on our map we cannot easily split the whole thing up into two pieces. The Padova FIS issue is recognised and I will ensure we fix this for the next chart update, coming this Thursday. Unfortunately Italy has historically not published the FIS boundaries in a format which is straightforward for chart producers to consume. Even now, they do not give the coordinates for the different sectors but instead refer the reader to a PDF chart, showing a line roughly following a river. Precision is apparently not a high priority. Nevertheless, we will reproduce this data as best we can. I understand your points. Milano FIS is divided along the river or along an Intersection Points line from Roma FIS, Padova NW and SW is divided by a depicted line on the N, but on the center area along a line that follow the CTR boundaries, South area is again a line that follow several Intersections, Roma and Brindisi have coordinates lines and easy to see the area. RE Bologna: If you apply the E and W to the freq will be perfect, but should appear as: Bologna East CTR 118.150 , Bologna West CTR 133.775. Most of Italian Pilots already know the differences, but foreigners coming from NE, if they are low, probably do not receive any answer if call on the wrong freq, especially at the extreme E or along the coast.  Sometime when we use a small screen (Mini iPad or iPhone) and we press the screen for info, the box cover the the spot, would be possible to move the box with the finger and adjust the lap time of the yellow line ? regards, Gianni
today i downloaded the update and I see Padova FIS 2 areas, is much better, the 2 freq are now present, but the boundary is still not correct on the southern part. The South FIS boundary should follow the alignment of these Intersections Points shown on my picture, same for Milano FIS southern part, the boundary is not correct, and should follow a line of these Intersection points (Tuscany area), see my picture posted before. Take in consideration, also, that FIR boundary between Milano and Roma FIR is not the boundary of Milano and Padova FIS.
If you need more help let me know,
regards,
Gianni
|
By giannisd - 4/3/2017 3:44:00 PM
+xThank you for the clarification. I can see there are two separate issues here (perhaps three). For Bologna CTR there isn't a straightforward fix in SkyDemon, as our airspace data is intended to map to frequencies hosted at airfields. In this case it works ok and both frequencies appear in the What's Here menu for the Bologna CTR airspace pieces, but there is no information helping the pilot decide which frequency to use. We could apply E or W to the frequencies, but on our map we cannot easily split the whole thing up into two pieces. The Padova FIS issue is recognised and I will ensure we fix this for the next chart update, coming this Thursday. Unfortunately Italy has historically not published the FIS boundaries in a format which is straightforward for chart producers to consume. Even now, they do not give the coordinates for the different sectors but instead refer the reader to a PDF chart, showing a line roughly following a river. Precision is apparently not a high priority. Nevertheless, we will reproduce this data as best we can.
regards,
Gianni
|
By Tim Dawson - 4/3/2017 4:31:48 PM
Historically means in the past.
If Italy are now publishing coordinates for FIS boundaries that is great. Unfortunately we (the whole team) are currently exhibiting at Aero Friedrichshafen which limits the amount of time we can spend transcribing the Italian AIP. We will be able to get back to the FIS boundary alignments when we return.
|
By giannisd - 4/3/2017 5:13:32 PM
+xHistorically means in the past. If Italy are now publishing coordinates for FIS boundaries that is great. Unfortunately we (the whole team) are currently exhibiting at Aero Friedrichshafen which limits the amount of time we can spend transcribing the Italian AIP. We will be able to get back to the FIS boundary alignments when we return.
gianni
|
By giannisd - 4/20/2017 11:49:16 AM
+xHistorically means in the past. If Italy are now publishing coordinates for FIS boundaries that is great. Unfortunately we (the whole team) are currently exhibiting at Aero Friedrichshafen which limits the amount of time we can spend transcribing the Italian AIP. We will be able to get back to the FIS boundary alignments when we return.
|
By Tim Dawson - 4/24/2017 9:33:32 AM
We have reviewed at least one of the boundaries between the radio services this AIRAC cycle in Italy. Perhaps you could comment after Thursday's chart update and we will see what is left to improve.
|
By giannisd - 4/28/2017 8:49:44 AM
+xWe have reviewed at least one of the boundaries between the radio services this AIRAC cycle in Italy. Perhaps you could comment after Thursday's chart update and we will see what is left to improve.
See my JPG chart attached or, if you do not trust my chart, read the AIP ENR 2.1 ;
for each FIR/UIR/ACC, on the Remarks, they indicate the line dividing each FIC/FIS Area by a list of Significant points.
I attached the PDF of the JPG, with Reader cancel all layers but leave only FIR/UIR/ACC and Significant Points, you will see a plain Blue line that is the FIC/FIS Area for each FIR.
reagrads, Gianni
|
By Tim Dawson - 5/2/2017 12:15:20 PM
Where did that chart come from?
Italy publishes its FIC boundaries very poorly, which is why it is a non-trivial issue recreating them digitally.
|
By giannisd - 5/2/2017 1:09:55 PM
+xWhere did that chart come from? Italy publishes its FIC boundaries very poorly, which is why it is a non-trivial issue recreating them digitally.
Read also ENR 2, for each FIR (Milano or Rome) you will find on the Remarks 3,4,5,6 the list the limits of FIS area, these points are generally IFR reporting points very easy to find and to use for drawing the line dividing the FIS.
This is the Milano Remarks page.
regrads,
Gianni
 
|
By giannisd - 5/2/2017 1:33:57 PM
+x+xWhere did that chart come from? Italy publishes its FIC boundaries very poorly, which is why it is a non-trivial issue recreating them digitally. The Chart is published on AIP ENR 61-1, is a very useful PDF I tried to send it to you, but the system will not accept, maybe is to large...Do you have a mail address I can send ? Read also ENR 2, for each FIR (Milano or Rome) you will find on the Remarks 3,4,5,6 the list the limits of FIS area, these points are generally IFR reporting points very easy to find and to use for drawing the line dividing the FIS. This is the Milano Remarks page. regrads, Gianni
|
By Tim Dawson - 5/30/2017 11:19:42 AM
We can look in to this, but not until next week, as we are preparing for an aviation trade show this week.
|
By giannisd - 3/16/2017 10:47:55 AM
Good day Tim,
Bologna CTR is divided in 2 zone Freq. 133.775 (N of the Line) and 118.150 (S of the Line) would be possible to see the divided line on the map and add N and S to the relative freq. ?
Would be possible to show, when you touch the zone on the screen, the 2 frequency NW 124.15 and SE 126.425 for Padova FIC as for MIlano, Brindisi and Rome FIC ?
best regards,
Gianni
|
By Tim Dawson - 5/3/2017 10:12:07 AM
Sounds so easy doesn't it? Except even the Milano FIC/ACC as described in note 3 there is further divided with reference to the "Po River" whose coordinates are of course not provided. We will check through to see if we can further refine the Milano and Padova FIC boundaries.
|
By Tim Dawson - 5/3/2017 10:24:30 AM
Ok, having redrawn some more borders I think the Milano and Padova FIC areas will be in better shape for our next chart update.
|
By giannisd - 5/26/2017 12:14:52 PM
 +xOk, having redrawn some more borders I think the Milano and Padova FIC areas will be in better shape for our next chart update.
+xOk, having redrawn some more borders I think the Milano and Padova FIC areas will be in better shape for our next chart update.
Gianni
|
|