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Great Circles


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peter@luthaus.de
p
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Hello,
suggested by Tim I post this request in the forum for discussion. I noted (it was already mentioned in the forum) that SkyDemon uses generally rhumb lines to connect waypoints. I find this unsatisfactory and annoying. Industry standard and the wanted way is great circles. There are many reasons why great circles should be used (compared to none using rhumblines):
1) Great circle is the standard for GPS navigation, so built in certified GPS use it and Skydemon is not consistent with the track actually flown even producing off track warnings.
2) For planning the total distance is not so different for short legs, but the off course deviation can be quite large. E.g planning from EDLW to EPWR the rhumb line goes through EDDP Delta, the great circle passes it completely.
3) Most pilots use Lambert projection charts approximating the earth's convergency for planning. So the straight lines drawn on paper will be close to great circles and it is unexpected that skydemon shows a different route.
4) Radials are great circles
5) Airways are great circles
As I find the rhumb line really a nuisance and also other pilots I know do so I suggest changing to great circles. I hope this could be implemented soon.
Peter


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Tim Dawson
Tim Dawson
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I will add that since the vast majority of SkyDemon subscribers appear to be happy with the current method, we would need a mightily compelling reason to switch at this stage. The current method gives the pilot a heading that, if he/she flies it, will get him/her from A to B (subject to wind). That simplicity is worth a lot, and that is what the notion of switching to great circles per leg is competing with. If you're navigating using SkyDemon as your GPS (which a huge percentage of our customers are) it doesn't matter, because the navigation instruments will also be helping you along the rhumb line.

Internally, SkyDemon uses both rhumb lines and great circles all over the place. In a very early beta, each leg in a route could be comprised of either. We had to ditch one of them because the choice was too confusing. We ditched great circles because a fundamental requirement of SkyDemon has always been to produce a PLOG with a heading to fly for a leg. You can't do that with great circles.

I'm open to re-introducing great circles into the mix, but not on a per-leg basis. I can imagine, for example, that if somebody planned an exceptionally long leg like the one shown above, where flying a great circle would give an appreciable fuel saving or where the midpoint different from the rhumb line midpoint to the great circle midpoint exceeded a given distance, we would ALSO draw the great circle on the map. This would give a visual clue that the leg could be "broken up" by the insertion of more turning points to create more rhumb lines. Or we could draw the great circle between takeoff and landing airfields for instance.
JulianScarfe
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Tim Dawson - 8/5/2016 11:34:21 AM
I'm open to re-introducing great circles into the mix, but not on a per-leg basis. I can imagine, for example, that if somebody planned an exceptionally long leg like the one shown above, where flying a great circle would give an appreciable fuel saving or where the midpoint different from the rhumb line midpoint to the great circle midpoint exceeded a given distance, we would ALSO draw the great circle on the map. This would give a visual clue that the leg could be "broken up" by the insertion of more turning points to create more rhumb lines. Or we could draw the great circle between takeoff and landing airfields for instance.

Had you considered changing the map projection at smaller scales, or is that just too hard?
GO

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peter@luthaus.de - 7/27/2016 12:01:14 PM
T67M - 7/27/2016 8:26:22 PM
peter@luthaus.de - 7/27/2016 9:10:18 PM
T67M - 7/27/2016 10:20:08 PM
Lars-Vater - 8/4/2016 1:47:13 PM
Tim Dawson - 8/5/2016 11:34:21 AM
JulianScarfe - 8/8/2016 8:19:06 AM
Tim Dawson - 8/8/2016 11:45:11 AM
Tim Dawson - 8/11/2016 10:10:02 AM
T67M - 8/11/2016 11:20:51 AM
Tim Dawson - 8/11/2016 1:30:45 PM
Tim Dawson - 8/15/2016 2:10:24 PM
T67M - 8/15/2016 7:07:20 PM
Stratajet - 1/18/2017 4:53:03 PM
ckurz7000 - 1/24/2017 1:34:43 PM
greg - 1/24/2017 9:39:23 PM
ckurz7000 - 1/29/2017 8:21:40 PM
Stratajet - 1/8/2018 2:49:50 PM
rg - 1/10/2018 11:26:33 AM
peter@luthaus.de - 1/18/2018 10:02:41 AM
Tim Dawson - 1/10/2018 4:57:59 PM
rg - 1/10/2018 5:11:31 PM
T67M - 1/10/2018 11:03:04 PM
Tim Dawson - 1/11/2018 12:19:46 PM
rg - 1/11/2018 12:25:44 PM
T67M - 1/11/2018 1:18:06 PM
ckurz7000 - 1/11/2018 2:05:23 PM
Sky Painter - 1/11/2018 3:29:13 PM
T67M - 1/11/2018 4:12:31 PM
             You make a good and valid point.
Sky Painter - 1/12/2018 3:56:56 PM
Tim Dawson - 1/15/2018 11:16:00 AM
Tim Dawson - 1/18/2018 10:35:44 AM
ckurz7000 - 1/18/2018 12:00:02 PM
peter@luthaus.de - 1/18/2018 1:30:10 PM
ckurz7000 - 1/23/2018 9:14:47 AM
Tim Dawson - 1/18/2018 12:45:42 PM
peter@luthaus.de - 1/18/2018 1:21:09 PM
T67M - 1/18/2018 1:18:10 PM
Tim Dawson - 1/19/2018 11:29:05 AM
Tim Dawson - 1/19/2018 11:30:43 AM
ckurz7000 - 1/23/2018 9:09:32 AM
Tim Dawson - 1/24/2018 3:03:45 PM
ckurz7000 - 1/25/2018 7:57:24 AM
jfw - 1/24/2018 3:51:34 PM
efrenken - 2/6/2018 4:01:02 AM
Cat - 3/22/2018 5:17:33 PM
Stratajet - 5/16/2019 7:44:33 AM
rg - 5/16/2019 8:05:11 AM
Tim Dawson - 5/16/2019 9:56:15 AM
rg - 5/16/2019 10:04:10 AM
T67M - 5/16/2019 10:54:45 AM
Cat - 5/16/2019 10:30:24 AM
Tim Dawson - 5/17/2019 1:59:11 PM
Cat - 5/29/2019 10:31:22 AM
rg - 1/24/2020 7:00:56 AM
T67M - 5/17/2019 3:06:58 PM
ArnaudC - 5/29/2019 10:08:35 AM
Tim Dawson - 1/24/2020 12:18:47 PM
rg - 1/26/2020 5:44:47 PM
hairy_kiwi - 5/19/2020 3:25:33 PM
Tim Dawson - 5/20/2020 9:42:44 AM
checklist - 7/19/2020 1:25:29 PM

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