Hi Tim, thank you very much for the clarification and solving that issue asap in your SkyDemon code (RTCS code in the NOTAM). So hopefully there will be no such airspace violations in the future because of the lack of the visual representation on the map.

I can only raise the awareness of all VFR pilots to check in every case additionally the NOTAM/Warning tab and not only rely on the visual part of the moving map. Otherwise it could leads to serious consequences by the authorities.

Thanks again

Thank you, that was very helpful. I was able to recreate the exact NOTAM and feed it through our system to determine how was it processed. I can confirm that SkyDemon did not graphically depict that NOTAM.

Hi Tim, here is the technical NOTAM (text and picture). Please check the NOTAM-parsing with your code and tell me, what is/was wrong in detail. Thank you in advance.

Text of the NOTAM:
D3412/24 (1)    Created 15/10/2024 15:01
Q) EDWW/QRTCS/IV/BO/W/000/100/5232N01322E030
A) EDWW B) FROM: 24/10/17 16:00 TO: 24/10/18 22:00
E) TEMPORARY RESTRICTED AREA EDR HUMBOLDT ESTABLISHED FOR SECURITY
MEASURES DURING STATE VISIT: 30NM RADIUS AROUND POSITION
523134N 0132220E. ALL FLIGHTS, INCLUDING THE OPERATION OF MODEL
AIRCRAFT AND UNMANNED AIRCRAFT SYSTEMS, ARE PROHIBITED IN THE AREA
EDR HUMBOLDT. THESE FLIGHT RESTRICTIONS DO NOT APPLY TO:
- MISSION FLIGHTS OF THE GERMAN ARMED FORCES, THE GERMAN FEDERAL
POLICE AND THE POLICE FORCES OF THE GERMAN FEDERAL STATES (LAENDER),
- FLIGHTS ON BEHALF OR AT THE INITIATIVE OF THE POLICE,
- FLIGHTS WITH THE PERMISSION OF THE POLICE,
- FLIGHTS BY STATE AIRCRAFT AND BY THE GERMAN ARMED FORCES RELATED TO
THE STATE VISIT,
- RESCUE AND DISASTER RELIEF FLIGHTS AND AMBULANCE FLIGHTS,
END PART 1 OF 3

D3412/24 (2)    Created 15/10/2024 15:01
Q) EDWW/QRTCS/IV/BO/W/000/100/5232N01322E030
A) EDWW B) FROM: 24/10/17 16:00 TO: 24/10/18 22:00
E) - FLIGHTS CONDUCTED ENTIRELY UNDER IFR (CHANGE PROCEDURES - Y AND Z
FLIGHT PLANS - ARE NOT ALLOWED) WHICH FULFIL THE ICAO STANDARDS LAID
DOWN IN ANNEX 17 (SAFEGUARDING INTERNATIONAL CIVIL AVIATION AGAINST
ACTS OF UNLAWFUL INTERFERENCE) AS WELL AS REGULATION (EC) NO.
300/2008 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND THE COUNCIL OF 11 MARCH 2008,
- FLIGHTS BY MODEL AIRCRAFT AND UNMANNED AIRCRAFT SYSTEMS AT A
DISTANCE OF MORE THAN 10NM FROM 523134N 0132220E, TAKING ACCOUNT OF
THE REGULATIONS OF SECTION 21(H) OF THE GERMAN AVIATION REGULATION
(LUFTVO) AND UNLESS THEY DO NOT FLY ABOVE AN ALTITUDE OF 120M ABOVE
GROUND.
PRIOR TO ENTERING, DEPARTING OR TRANSITING THE AIRSPACE, THESE
AUTHORISED MANNED VFR FLIGHTS SHALL REPORT TO THE POLICE OF BERLIN
AND WILL BE SUBJECT TO APPROVAL. THE PROCEDURES FOR OBTAINING THIS
APPROVAL WILL BE COMMUNICATED BY THE POLICE VIA THE APPROPRIATE
CHANNELS.
END PART 2 OF 3

D3412/24 (3)    Created 15/10/2024 15:00
Q) EDWW/QRTCS/IV/BO/W/000/100/5232N01322E030
A) EDWW B) FROM: 24/10/17 16:00 TO: 24/10/18 22:00
E) TRAINING FLIGHTS, PHOTO, VIDEO AND CALIBRATION FLIGHTS (INCLUDING
UNDER IFR) ARE NOT ALLOWED.
CONTINUOUS AIR-GROUND VOICE COMMUNICATION WATCH SHALL BE MAINTAINED
ON THE FREQUENCY 135.600MHZ (CALLSIGN POLICE INFO) BY ALL AUTHORISED
MANNED VFR FLIGHTS WHILE FLYING WITHIN THE RESTRICTED AREA.
TRANSIT PERMISSIONS IN LINE WITH SECTION 17 OF THE GERMAN AVIATION
REGULATION (LUFTVO) WILL NOT BE GRANTED.
NOTE: TRANSIT PERMISSIONS ISSUED FOR OTHER RESTRICTED AREAS EDR4,
EDR54, EDR55, EDR56 OR EDR146 DO NOT INCLUDE A TRANSIT PERMISSION
FOR THE RESTRICTED AREA EDR HUMBOLDT.
LOWER: GND
UPPER: FL100

Picture:

Thanks. I would like to properly test the situation by passing the actual NOTAM through the actual depiction code, so it would still be good to have it (with the original Q line etc).

With no real details of the NOTAM it's hard for me to speculate on why it might not have appeared. In Germany specifically there would usually be an AIP SUP with any such restrictions, separately depicted. Possibly the authorities in Germany might have an exact copy of the NOTAM as issued, in which case, we would be able to look at that and determine why it was not visible on the map. It may have been encoded incorrectly by the originator (inappropriate Q-line) which would explain its absence.

Hi Tim,

sorry for beeing late adressing this issue in this forum. But on the day where it happened I was not able to do the post and on the same day (18.10.2024) the NOTAM expired at 10 p.m. (22:00).

The question is, if it is a generally problem with RA(T)s (especially in Germany) and does this issue happens often (in other countries too) or this was a one-time-error. Do you have information about that?

I can tell you for sure (and the authorities can tell that too) that there happened a lot of violations inside this RA(T). The temporary restricted area was active for 2 days because of the visit of the last president of the USA (Joe Biden).

And you are completely right, the SkyDemon map does not release the pilot from checking the NOTAMs of the respective country (e.g. the DFS in Germany) and/or the NOTAM view of each entry in the NOTAM tab in SD (and click on it). Every pilot has a duty of care to use all possibilities of obtaining the necessary information for the flight. This also applies to flights that have the same departure and destination airport and do not cover a large distance.

Nevertheless, due to the reliability and the good experience of the software, pilots (often) rely on the visual map view. And that was the problem in that case. It is expected that restricted areas in particular (whether temporary or permanent) are permanently projected onto the map for the active period.

I can only ask that other pilots also comment on this post with a similar issue, as I do on their behalf. And hopefully just-in-time, when the issue occurs to avoid this problem in the future.

It's hard to say at this point, since the NOTAM is long-gone. Could I suggest please that if you notice a problem with the depiction of a NOTAM, you contact us while it still exists, so that we can investigate?

Hi SkyDemon team,

from 17.-19.10.2024 there was a relly big dimensioned RA(T) - Temporary Restricted Area activated by NOTAM in Germany round of Berlin (see attached PDF "ED-R Humboldt vom 17.-18.10.pdf" and picture below).


This area was NOT shown permanently on the map in SkyDemon. This resulting in some airspace violations from pilots using SkyDemon as their primary navigation/NOTAM source. Other navigation software had shown this area permanently on the map (if it's needed I can tell you the other products).

As you can see in the attached video, the RA(T) was shown in the NOTAM tab in the section "Warnings". But only when tapping actively on "Show on map" the area was shown in the map, but after some seconds this area disappered again. So the user/pilot was forced to actively select the RA(T) from the NOTAM tab, otherwise the user could not see the area on the map. 



Additionally there were no warnings in the flight when the pilot was flying towards or inside this Restricted Area.

Flying through a Restricted Area without permission is a criminal offense and will be severely punished by the German law.

Could you explain why this active RA(T) was not permanently shown in the moving map and why there is no warning when flying towards or inside this area? Is it planned to change this behaviour?

Thank you in advance