The Milan TMA in northern Italy is depicted as being one single big Class A chunk, whereas it has different minimum levels especially along the Alps (val d'Aosta) and the lakes.

Can you be specific about which areas should have different vertical boundaries, with reference to the Italian AIP ENR 2.1?

Thanks!

If you check the Italian AIP (2.1.1.1-1) under point 1 the Milano FIR south of the Swiss / Italian border and north of a zigzagging line defined by a number of coordinates is defined as class G up to FL 195 with a number of exceptions as defined under Remark 1.

If you have a look at either the Swiss or Italian 1:500k VFR chart the areas are immediately obvious. It's definitely not a single chunk of Class A airspace.

shorrick are you exchanging the Milano FIR (ENR 2.1.1.1-1) for the Milano TMA (ENR 2.1.1.1-7)?



Enrico

R 44 II from Italy

Oops sorry, indeed I am. However looking on the current maps, part of the TMA starting eastward from the Gran Paradiso restricted area abeam Forzo then upward to CHamprocher, Issime, Piedicavallo, Varallo, Gravellona, Premosello is clearly labeled A from FL 170 to FL195 only. There are similar areas eastwards of it - surely if they're on the maps they are (or should be) somewhere in the AIP, i'll make sure to find the appropriate chapter.



And yes, considering i just flew vfr to and from Lugano (LSZA) no longer than two weeks ago through what SD depicts as class A and the map as class G without being intercepted /shot down/causing raised eyebrows i'm pretty sure the maps are accurate.

If there's an exception documented in the AIP then we should definitely be depicting it in SkyDemon. Did you find the other areas documented in there?

Update: I can confirm that we've updated the area around Lugano to correctly reflect the exceptions from the Milano TMA in Swiss airspace. The new chart has been published, so opening your Charts window should update the Italian chart automatically.

Alright so I found the reference. ENR 2.1.1-6 under point 2.4 specifies that the various Milan VFR sectors (e.g. including those on the italian side) are described in ENR 6.3.3 which in turn offers a very accurate graphical depiction of the various areas and their various min-max FL's / altitudes. There are no geographical coordinates for the zones however.

Interesting, thanks. Unfortunately without a categorical description of the areas (their coordinates) it's not practical for us to add these areas to SkyDemon at the moment. I'll see if we can contact the Italian authorities to obtain the definitions of the airspace.

That's what i thought too. I'm pretty sure they must have them somewhere - I doubt Jeppesen and the like just did a photocopy of that page . The guys at aip@enav.it should definitely be able to help.